Sorry for rushing things along again, but I'm trying to hurry things toward the next encounter. That said, you'll have to solve the puzzle yourselves.

Also, here's a bigger picture since the one in the main thread is so small.

Sorry guys, I'm spent for the night. Trying to do it gave me a headache. I'll link the generator in the subject field, the goal is to make a pattern that becomes the pattern on the right on the 4th generation. I'm unlikely to be of much use tomorrow either, as I have a full day and will probably be exhausted when I get a break. I'm guessing "three horned dragon" is what it's supposed to look like, but anything I tried that looked remotely like that didn't work.

I already tried every pattern I could think of with that head.

This is the problem

>>996
You're extremely close.

Everybody please roll perception, please. Taking ten is not an option at this time.

I think that's the best we're gonna get out of perception right now

>>1005
Righto. Just let me finish setting up the surprise round.

y can't take 10 or use passive perception?

>>1007
Because going by the rules for this sort of situation, nobody's was high enough.

>>1008
What's the use of having us roll to avoid getting surprised if we had to beat 30? Only Lia and Walala can get a little higher than that (32 and 33 respectively), so wouldn't it just be easier to say, "Everyone's surprised, no ifs, buts or whats about it"?

>>1008
How could a 30 not be high enough? I can't believe that every single enemy rolled higher than 30 on their Stealth.

>>1009
>>1010
Nobody's passive was high enough.

>>1011
Pardon my intrusion, but then again if the passive value was the significant, then there was other reason to make them roll?

>>1018
If nobody's passive was high enough, then everybody had to roll in order to have a chance of seeing them in the first place.

>visit /teaparty/ first
>see multiple posts from Lili and Astaroth streaming
>well since they've both been here a while /parlor/ must be updated right
>come here, 0 new posts
>mfw

Hurf I was out all day, old lady.

so i just charge nearest enemy right i can hit elevation 1 flying

>>1030
You can hit elevation 1, yes.

Er... we need some better tactical thinking up in here. That healing infusion on Yagi should have gone to one of the people who were bloodied. Yagi still has lots of HP left, and his dwarven armor power.

We also have a variety of interrupts to use when attacked, and we should be using them, like Chord of Resilience.

>>1048
Actually, I thought save ends was a bit too harsh. Or... Something. I know there was a reason I didn't pick save ends but I'm pretty sure it wasn't to spite you guys.

possibly more appropriate battle music

>>1049
It would have been more consistent if the zone did its effects when the creature sustained it rather than when our turns end. Also, having TWO of the creatures that do that is problematic (controllers are recommended 1 to an encounter).

Anyways, Rock can get out of the zone by using Pressing Strike, and I can pull Lia to the edge of the zone if need be. I'd rather not, though, I'll probably need to use my second wind as my minor on my turn. Luckily Hide has invigorating stride so that + a majestic word can probably get him out of the zone, though Rock really needs a heal (Lia and Kadol can heal themselves).

Pop out any dailies that seem useful, and everyone should have a new action point to spend, since 2 encounters is a milestone (and therefore a new AP). We'll surely have an extended rest prior to any future encounters.

>>1051
Fair enough.

Encounter looks hard, good luck.

If Rock misses, then please use Rhyme of the Blood-seeking, Bard-chan.

That 19 is probably not going to hit, BUT! Rhyme of the Blood-seeking Blade should make it hit.

I think this is very important, as if Rock hits with Resurgent Strike he can remove the weakening condition from himself and then follow it up with a damaging rage attack. So Cake, it's in your hands now!

Good luck, Cake!

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is a hit!

Since I killed something I get 1 tHP, Rotho. Everytime I drop something I get 1 tHP.

>>1065
THPs don't stack, though.

I still get 1 tHP since I lost the previous one.

fix'd

Also why wouldn't they stack?

>>1069
Temporary hit points don't stack. Them's the rules. It's probably to prevent things that hand them out frequently from being completely overpowered.

>>1069
If they stacked, my level 2 dwarven battlerager fighter that gains 10 temporary hit points on almost every one of its attacks would be almost impossible to kill.

>Ammunition names are keyed to certain ammunition types, but any of the enchantments described in [Adventurer's Vault 2] can be placed on any type of ammunition: for instance, it's possible to or acquire an arrow or a sling bullet has the attributes of a bolt of clumsiness.

I'm not sure if it's apparent yet, but I've decided to only share monster knowledge check information with the individuals who succeeded the checks in question. That means you'll have to rely on them to relay the information to you.

Makk needs to use her interrupt power to grant Yagi resistance to the damage, and Cake needs to use his interrupt power to prevent 10 to me, I think. This is for optimum allocation of resources.

wait wat, how did it even hit kadol/reach that far if he's slowed and kadol is total concealed

>>1080
oh, it was poison spit or something. BUT STILL

>>1081
It's artillery. It artillerizes.

>>1082
even then, a -5 should make it pretty hard to hit

>>1083
It rolled pretty high.

*flip desk*

>>1085
It seems to be a common theme for both sides to roll very high or very low.

>>1085
see 3d6 is gud

>>1080
I think the part that is baffling is the creature opting to attack enemies in a pretty secure location.

>>1088
because it's dum

Also, makk, cake, gonna need you guys to post your interrupts tonight if you're gonna make them...

>>1086
Actually there's been a whole lot of middling rolls from what I've seen.

>>1083
If you manage to kill the necromancer its zone will vanish and we can use the mist again.

Fly -2 penalty for defender's aura, did you count it etc.

>>1092
Yes.

o ok

also thp from daily item use

Yes, yes, but I still need to wait for Cake before I can update.

...The minions deal damage on a miss?

>>1102
The minions deal damage on a miss.

>>1103
I can't find a single minion in any monster book that deals damage on a miss.

Not even the epic tier minions.

I always assumed it was against the design philosophy of minions to have them deal damage on a miss.

>>1104
It was supposed to make the encounter more difficult.

Effects everywhere.

You might wanna do something about progression soon.

>>1107
I guess I have no choice.

>>1108
Looks like you're the party, Attaroo.

>>1109
If just one more person decides to drop out, I'm shutting this down.

Or you can turn it into Rock and Kadol's Pretty Princess Parlor.

>>1111

>>1112

>>1112
I'm serious though. If Voyee drops out, just have Rock and Kadol do the last encounter and scale it to two people. WE CAN DO THIS.

>>1114
Scaling it down to that few is kinda...

Oh am I supposed to not post.

>dread of the grave

>>1117
Yes you are!

Did Rock get slowed again or something.

>>1119
Nope, just didn't remove it yet. Doing so now.

Don't forget saving throw against ongoing damage, Bern.

im not done wit my turn ok

>>1123
Alright. No it's not dead just yet.

Okay, now it's dead.

plz roll saving throw for poison now k

>>1128
k

loooooooool Concealment so useless.

Are those all tied to the same condition? For example, if I shook off the dazed part, would the other parts be removed?

>>1134
I suppose so. It would make sense that not being dazed would mean it no longer affects you.

>>1135
Okay, then I guess it's up to Superior Will's start-of-turn-save.

Brutal Slam hits Fortitude by the way for what it's worth, if it hits Jasker is smashed to -A 21 and the Minion at -B 21 dies. And I'll be spending an Action Point either way, so tell me if hit or not etc.

>>1138
Also re-roll damage dice but that can wait until confirmation of hit etc. Fort should be low on casters right.

>>1138
22? That's a hit.

>>1140
K, so the minion dies to auto-damage and Jasker is pushed two, time to charge and re-roll damage dice.

Normally your last attack wouldn't hit, but since you knocked it prone with your first attack, you get combat advantage, so your roll is 24 instead of 22.

>>1143
I guess I should remember these things sometime.

Keep focusing on the demon-guy, I'll try to use hand of radiance on all of the minions on my turn.

>>1147
Actually, with their new position, I think Rebuke Undead would be better. It's vs. Will and ally-friendly, and I don't think I need to save it anymore.

>>1148
Where are the non-ally-friendly attacks over Yagi?

>>1150
You lost me.

Saku, I don't think Makk is coming back.

I'd volunteer to play Walala if Hanyuu isn't interested and you don't want the extra work.

>>1162
You're already DM'ing another game. I'll speak to Hanyuu and see if I can't convince him to play.

>>1163
I'll do my best to help out Hanyuu when I get home then.

>>1163
Considering Rin, I don't think some easy modo games could really tire her.

My adventure tools keeps bugging. Is there a better program to design monsters with?

>>1168
Adventure Tools is as good as it gets (as far as I know). You just have to learn to live with the bugs.

Usually it will mess up the triggered abilities once, but if you remove the abilities and start over with them it should be okay.

I would have used Demand Justice earlier on the dragon but since I think I need to target the creature that I want to affect, I don't believe I can actually use the power on something that's removed from play.

4+15+2+1+1. Wow, Bern, turns out there was a bonus that you forgot. Lucky you!

>>1175
Nice rebuttal, by the way.

>>1177
Really, I would've killed him if he wasn't such a sore sight for the eyes.

I actually feel like decking him good. Do I need to roll for attack if I wake him up and then punch him?

>>1180
Nope.

Oh good, doing that once others have had a chance to respond to the situation.

>party was level 6
>a lot more efficent than limbo party

>>1184
Well at least now I can stop going easy on them and throw out those boss monsters I've been saving.


No, this isn't an "I was going easy on you" retcon, this is an admission of helping you guys more than you needed. I'll wish you good luck, but I'm not gonna make the fights easier.

>>1185
>fudgin rolls
Anyways they just have one encounter left right?

>>1185
>fudging rolls >monsters will now be harder
>monsters could already hit players in that cloud thing which gave -5 to enemy attacks

>>1186
Pretty much, though it won't be like a standard encounter, I'll reveal that much.
>>1187
Be afraid. Be very afraid.

>>1187
I think we should give up on penalties to attack rolls, because I think Astaroth's made all his monsters to never miss thinking it's good monster design.

>>1184
Because Barbarian > Ranger, obv.

>>1189
I gotta admit, your barbarian seems to do an amazing job getting the things killed.

>>1190
Of course, he Rocks.

>>1191
DPR only 17.7 though.

>>1189
Well, not only that, but effects like stun and all that everywhere on top of usually threatening damage.

>>1189
To clarify, I think making it useless to impose attack penalties isn't good monster design because it just discourages players from even attempting control outside of afflicting status effects. I get a choice for a -2 penalty to attack roll ability, f'rinstance, in a close burst 5, but I see no reason to take it because there's no way enemies will miss with just a -2 penalty.

Clever monster design at this level should involve auras and special effects more, like marking, free shifts, battle field repositioning, stopping OAs/charges etcetera.

>>1194
Well, even with a insane base attack value, that small penalty could help.
Suppose you got 22 AC and your opponent got a +15 attack bonus. Your enemy could hit you with a 7. So it's 6/20 probability for him to miss, just a 30%. But with the -2 penalty his chances to fail the attack increases to 40%.

I'm telling you, they rolled lucky. Their attack isn't any higher than average for a monster of the same level.

>>1185
Wait, when did you fudge rolls? When did we need you to fudge rolls?

Also, have you done any revising that wasn't fixing monster stat blocks to be more... well, like befitting their roles? Minions that deal damage on a miss and lurkers with big AoE condition-inflicting powers are kind of off.

>>1197
Probably never, which is why I'm going to stop doing that.

Pretty sure I can't really mess up controllers and brutes, though. I even copied some parts from existing monsters and scaled them down to something level appropriate.

I can retrain stuff now that we've leveled, right?

Even though I think there are much better themes for me than Ordained Priest, I'll stick with it. Flavor etc.

Otherwise, my sheet's updated for level 7. I retrained my Resilient Focus feat for Superior Implement Training (Accurate Staff), and I chose Rain of Blood as my level 7 encounter power. Because it's awesome. Rendering enemies in an AoE vulnerable 5 to all damage, and granting allies in the same aoe a +4 bonus to attacks as part of the same power is just awesome.

Is Ironwolf Warrior legal, then?

>>1199
>>1203
Sure, go nuts.

Hmm, interesting loophole I found within my own restrictions on the enchantment levels. I wonder if you guys have spotted it yet or plan to take advantage of it?

>>1228
If it involves me not getting my fancy clothes, well..

>>1229
No, not that.

>>1228
I believe they still don't work that part, but for your own sanity, change it or something, bern is the group.

>>1231
No, I'm talking about the artificer feat. Not sure there's a good, legal reason to say no.

DM saying No is reason enough.

ohgod i hope i got everything right

Okay, update is not ready tonight. I'll have it up tomorrow morning I hope. But I am going to be adamant about one detail :

Come Sunday, you will be in initiative for the final encounters!

Okay, in case it's not already clear, this is your last chance to do anything before the final encounter. Cause tomorrow, one way or another, the next encounter is happening.

I'll exchange my +2 Steadfast Amulet for Yagi's +2 Amulet of Protection. Other than that, I can't think of anything I else that I need or want in my price range, except for perhaps a Staff of Ruin. Seems like a low priority compared to other stuff, though.

I have a Deep-Pocket Cloak +2 and a Shockweave Armour +1 and a Sacrificial Gouge +2. Feel free to disenchant and re-enchant etc.

I'm going to need everybody to update their character sheets to level 7 and show what you have equipped and such and such.

Lili, Makk, Cake, Bern, and Hide, please update your sheets with your choices for level 7 powers/abilities before tonight.

I don't see the Coif of Mindiron, Backlash Tattoo, Boots of Eagerness, and Belt of Dwarvenkind on anybody's sheet. If they're not used before the the next encounter starts, I'm not going to give you guys the chance to equip them or anything.

Makk, if you're gonna read that book, I suggest you do so soon, and then tell me if you plan on crafting any alchemical items (the Master Mixer feat is godly for you in this instance).

With regards to the junk from the first encounter, here's a breakdown of how much you'd get from disenchanting everything:
flaming superior crossbow +1 (level 5) (1,000 uncommon) = 500 gp of residuum
magic bayonet +1 (level 1) (360 common) = 72 gp of residuum
hide armor of resistance +1 (level 2) (520 uncommon) = 260 gp of residuum
extinguishing battleaxe +1 (level 3) (680 uncommon) = 340 gp of residuum
chain mail of resistance +2 x2 (level 7) (2600 uncommon each) = 2,600 gp of residuum
flaming halberd +1 x2 (level 5) (1,000 uncommon each) = 1,000 gp of residuum

In game, you have twelve hours before the next day starts to enchant stuff and whatnot. That rod I gave you should help speed things along, but there's only one of those. You must sleep for six of those hours or else you're not getting benefits of an extended rest. Walala might be a special case since the living construct racial trait says she doesn't have to sleep, but I'll have to consult with Mion to clarify how that would work out.

Clock's ticking, everyone.

Geez, bossy.

>>1259
The Marauder's Armor is Hide armor. You're missing a point in AC.

I can't can
t
stay up a moment later or I'll fall over alseep where I am. Sorry everyone, I'll update tomorrow morning. That should give you some time to sort things out.

Putting all that disenchanting together leaves us with a paltry 4772 residuum, though other things can be disenchanted if people discard them, like my +2 magic staff. The whole thing seems like a lot of effort to calculate for enchanting/disenchanting for just one battle... for future parlor DMs, if you give out treasure at all, do it in a very easy-to-organize, straight-forward fashion. Having to disenchant and re-enchant a bunch of stuff is annoying.

>>1263
The residuum was supposed to take care of that. I didn't think you guys would leave it behind.

Anyway, I'm literally dropping you into the next encounter now, though I'll give you a chance to position yourselves first. If you were putting something off until the last second, then now's the time to do it.

>>1265
>position selves
>no map available

>>1266
It's coming, yeesh. I'm just typing up your narrative. Unless you'd rather I add that in later.

>>1267
Can't smell if it's coming when you say "literally dropping you into next encounter now, unless you want to..."

I apologize for the awkwardness of all this, but I really, really, really wanted to get you all there today and wasn't sure how to handle that otherwise.

Although at the rate this sleepiness is setting in, it might not happen until tomorrow anyway.

Hookay, everybody who's out there right now please give me your positions.

I wanted to just fling an arrow in his face but probably not allowed for a surprise round type action etc

>>1283
Not after what happened the last time I gave you one, no.

>>1285
what I guess I mean is, an action outside the initiative which is going to immediately start the encounter anyw-you know, nevermind.

>>1286
Not doing it intentionally. I thought some of you (Fays) might have wanted to ham it up first.

are you dead yet?

Punishing Eye would be really helpful against Wiseman, actually, note "enemies within 3 squares of the eye do not benefit from concealment." Wiseman uses shadow walk to gain concealment, and it boosts some of his powers, so denying him that would be excellent. Plus, 5 extra damage. My vote is for Makk to give Fays some healing and then use Punishing Eye. It will also make our nova round all that much more effective.

>>1334
On the other hand, Wiseman annoyingly has resist 5 psychic so it might not be the best choice. Spike Wire could be better.

If Fays doesn't move too far, I can include him in the burst of my Rain of Blood for a free attack bonus.

What I do depends on whether or not I shake off my daze at the start of my turn. If I do shake it off there's a good chance I'll pull out Staff of the War Wizard and enlarge the burst of my Rain of Blood so I can hit both the minions and grant the attack bonus to Rock, Yagi, and Fays.

Wiseman and the Stormwarden aren't going anywhere based on the conditions imposed upon them.

I'll concoct a crazy plan by tomorrow (my time) and run it past you guys and/or girls.

Sorry for not posting earlier etc. haven't been feeling well plus copious amounts of Skyrim.

>>1341
While I'm upset that you didn't post today, the possibility of a crazy plan intrigues me, so I'll let it slide for now.

Just try not to attack the party again.

In the interest of speeding things up, I'll let both Kadol and Yagi take their turns before I give any further input if they like.

Priorities:
Fays banishes the dragon to the feywild on his turn. Ignore the dragon for now.
Keep Wiseman dazed.
Take advantage of the vulnerability and attack bonuses to go crazy on damage. Use your APs and stuff.

Don't worry, we're not finished yet. We can take this. It won't be easy, but we can do it.

was the dragon adjacent to Rock before the push?

>>1360
Yes.

>>1361
Oh, but I believe it missed you with all of its attacks, so if whatever you're trying to do triggers on a hit, then...

>>1362
Curtain of Steel only requires the enemy hits or misses me, but since Kadol pushed it out of my retaliatory range I can't use it anyway.

>>1363
Technically you could still use it on the first attack, before I pushed it.

The first attack missed me, and my triggered action DOES require a hit.

I only see one attack...?

>>1368
Saku didn't word it well in his post, but he said the breath attack was actually 3 separate attacks.

That's why I pushed it, to make sure the next attack wouldn't hit as many people.

>>1369
Well since the turn shifted I missed the timing anyhow, but I really wish Astaroth'd be more clear on these things so others who WEREN'T in stream also know if they have triggered actions available for use.

>>1370
My bad. I'll try to be more clear about those things next time.

ok so wat do

>>1372
Deal a whole lot of damage to the best targets possible. Frankly I'd like to see Wiseman dead before he starts using his zone and dominating everyone.

You have a +4 attack bonus and they're vulnerable 5 to all damage. Unleash hell. Use a rage and an action point if you want.

Rage and Action Point used. We'll likely have more resources for the fight after this then, I guess. Did the best I could under No Charge circumstances etc.

Wiseman won't last much longer ne.

As for healing, don't worry about Kadol, she can take care of herself for now (dwarven armor power and minor action second wind are unused). Focus on keeping Rock and Yagi up. Likewise Lia can still burn the diamond cincture heal next turn. We really need Walala's 20 tHP thing soon.

Self-sufficiency is a great benefit that I feel is often overlooked in character creation in favor of 1 additional point of AC or something.

>>1379
Might want to do this before the gargoyle gets another attack. If it somehow manages a hit, not even the THP buffer Yagi has right now will keep him alive.

>>1383
wat

>>1384
They're still marked, don't worry about it~

>>1385
Why am I being slid away from Stormwarden and co.

>>1384
Trust me, I'm good at video games.

>>1387
So explain.

>+25 bonus to damage
This is what a NORMAL monster of its level gets from stoneform.

For a minion it should be divided by 4.

>>1388
They will target me since Rotho didn't make the dragon blow me up, unlike almost every other encounter.

Worst comes to worst, I save you from 10 damage.

>>1392
If a defender stays adjacent to enemies, the defender can hit them back whenever they shift or attack an ally on top of the normal OA if they just move. You've just moved Yagi away from Stormwarden.

>>1393
Fuck video games. I delete post for my lack of knowledge.

>>1393
It'd make sense of Cake could somehow get to B-10 and use hellfire and brimstone, killing all the minions, then uses Majestic Word to slide Yagi back into place.

The main problem with that is shifting, difficult terrain, etc.

>>1391
It was going to be a normal monster until I found out it was bad encounter design. Unfortunately, there weren't any minion stone form gargoyles that I could find for reference, so I didn't change that value.

>minion gets 15 tHP
You do realize you can't just take a normal monster, reduce its HP to 1, and call it a minion, right

What's good encounter design anyway. As long as it's challenging and winnable, it's fine, right.

>>1397
Yes, yes...

>>1398
Well, you can say I have a stick up my ass or something, but my response to that is no. An encounter being hard and winnable is not automatically good. There are lot of encounters that are hard and winnable that are also frustrating, boring, or otherwise poorly designed.

I'm also a firm believer that (almost) everything in 4E monster design is the way it is for a reason, so I will complain loudly if I think something is amiss in that regard. I may not always be right, but I hope it will at least make the person in charge think about why they designed X like Y, and consider if that's really a good reason.

In retrospect, and please do not take this as an insult, Astaroth, I'm not trying to slam you here, I'm trying to give some feedback: I think this encounter should have had some of the gargoyles and stuff as normal monsters, with Wiseman as an elite leader (and slightly toned-down powers). The 2nd phase could've still been a solo fight.

The advantages of this setup would be that Wiseman would be almost as deadly, but the rest of the encounter could be more robust, and Wiseman wouldn't be such a mountain of HP to be beaten down and feel "Oh God even after he falls we've still got a lot to do."

>>1402
I had actually considered that before. It would have been a lot like that fight in Chrono Trigger vs. Azaela (sp?) and the Black Tyranno in that regard, where the big scary dragon would be the highlight of the fight, while Wiseman is the one you take down first since weaker HP and his abilities would compliment the dragon's (original plan was to have an attack useable against weakened or dazed enemies that did a lot more damage, except the dragon couldn't make either happen on its own).

At some point I decided it wasn't 'difficult' or 'challenging' enough and here we are. I should have kept in mind whether or not it'd still be fun after all the changes.

>>1403
Also scrapped an idea for fighting your way through the tower against hordes of minions and/or undead so you'd burn up some dailies and make the remaining fights slightly more challenging, because that would add yet another encounter. And I was getting the feeling that everybody was eager to get this over with and move on to the next campaign, which made me care a bit less about stuff like a proper setup or good narrative or what have you. I guess you could say I was slightly embittered about that and the rest of the adventure suffered for it. I'm sorry about that.

>>1404
Well I for one enjoy playing Kadol, generic though she may be, and even though I didn't really see many hints or clues to put together for a dramatic conclusion in the finale I didn't think the story was bad or anything. I think you've done overall a fine job for a newbie DM, even if I think your encounter design philosophy needs work. I was not really in a hurry to move onto the next campaign, but I believe I have always made an effort to be engaged and active.

Really, it's either trying new things or sticking to the monster manual. A few minions having powers comparable to normal monsters shouldn't be such a big deal.

>>1405
>>1406
The 'hints' (undead, devil servant, giant fly, warlock that gets stronger when his enemies are dead or bloodied, speaks Thayan) were supposed to point to Myn as the final boss.

Yes, really. That was twist. Sorry if you're disappointed.

At the very least the last boss is almost a direct copy of an existing monster in the post-MM3 style (bumped up from an elite), so I can't screw that up.

>>1406
This is just wrong. Consider that 4 of these monsters put together could do over 100 damage to a single target in one round. For the same XP value of 1 normal monster of the level, you can get 4 of these monsters. It's hard to stop them too, considering they have such high resistance in stoneform, you're pretty much guaranteed to take 1 attack, and because of their 15 tHP you can't even eliminate them quickly without a dedicated attack (minions are supposed to go down easily). If it was something like 5 tHP it'd be fine. The problem is these minions have both offensive and defensive capabilities that are well above the level of what a minion should have, and that is very problematic. One or the other I could see (though I would still substantially cut down on the damage), but not both.

I do not believe you HAVE to stick to the monster manuals to get balanced monsters. You just need to think about why the monsters are designed the way they are (and I feel like this is a step many people miss), and consider the monster as the sum of its parts. This is why I think it's a bad idea to copy-paste effects from one monster to a totally unrelated monster without considering the implications of doing so.

I could give a more in-depth treastie on monster design later but I really do not have the time now.

>>1408
To use the current encounter as an example, we started with two of the stoneform gargoyles. Did Astaroth really fill up the encounter level's worth of XP? I think having less of them would be the balancing factor here, treating them as though they're worth two minions each. As long as the DM recognizes that they're more powerful than the average minion, it shouldn't be an issue.

I haven't noticed anything boring or frustrating about the current encounter yet, either.

>>1409
Even two of them is 50 damage, which is WELL above what 2 minions should be capable of. And they still get resist 25 to all damage in stoneform, and 15 tHP on top of that.

Again, you cannot just take a regular monster, reduce its HP to 1, and call it a minion (there IS a gargoyle with these exact capabilities in the MV, same level, same role, same numbers for its powers, but it's not a minion).

>wake up
>+25 to damage
what.

...Eh, screw it. The damage values go down by one on the final boss to compensate for the level difference between it and the monster it's based off of, but that's it. It's only one monster so it gets to do a significant amount of damage (based off of an existing monster that's post-MM3, I might add! And that one had help!) At least, unlike the original, it doesn't list itself as having immunity to dazing.

>>1412
Isn't the original a full monster though whereas this is a minion

>>1413
I think he's talking about the 2nd phase form, not the gargoyle.

>>1414
Exactly. It's thematic and has similar keywords, so it all works out.

On a related note, Walala should use shard swarm to escape the gargoyles. Hopefully they can't react to teleportation. Walala needs to do this to get into a better position to use her ranged powers.

>>1416
Going by the description of the power and the flavor text, I'd say it does not trigger on teleportation.

I maek post because I'm legit.

Suddenly my courage to DM goes wayyyy down.

>>1419
Just be careful with what kind of abilities you give minions and it should be okay

Seriously though, I'd be open to giving feedback on monsters on the condition that I absolutely could not share what I learned with the other players (and of course I wouldn't plan their moves for them either). It's not the ideal situation with me knowing about it, but if it'd increase your confidence I'd be willing.

Also, I'm open to any criticism and/or feedback on my own DMing style as well.

>>1420
Holding you to that. One day I'll corner you and barrage you with my monster designs and see what you think.

>>1420
I wish I'd thought of that sooner.

Here is my plan:

Makku:
Shard Swarm to teleport to F-7.
Lob an alchemist fire to attempt to take out the minions near Kadol.
Curative Admixture on Yagi.
Own discretion: Action point to pop Punishing Eye over at E-7.

Fays:
Shift to C-10, under the Gargoyle. This is making the best of a bad situation.
From there, banish the dragon to the feywild. It will provoke an OA from the gargoyle, but that's a lot better than provoking an OA from all 3. Plus, Yagi can punish the Gargoyle, likely killing it, if he takes the OA, which would mean Fays wouldn't get hit anyway.
Majestic Word Rock and slide him to D-6. Two reasons for this:
1. Avoid bunching up. This is crucial, as Wiseman is certain to use an area burst 1 power that creates a damaging zone and restrains on his turn.
2. Gives Rock charge space. With this positioning Rock can charge either Wiseman or the Stormwarden on his turn.

From there, we buckle down and hope for the best.

>>1423
While I believe this plan is flexible, I must urge you to, if at all possible, PLEASE do not stand within 2 squares of each other. We don't want to give Wiseman the option of hitting 2 of us within the zone. It's pretty much unavoidable in the case of Fays/Yagi, but at the very least that will make Wiseman hit his allies with the zone as well.

I just realized that since Punishing Eye is technically a separate source from an attack... if you hit a target that's vulnerable 5 all and punishing eye is next to it, it takes 5 extra damage from the attack and then another 10 damage from punishing eye.

It also effectively cancels out Wiseman's psychic resistance.

Oh, this is going to be fun.

OAs so useless when nothing has Ranged attacks, and everything is close or melee.

>>1445
How many powers DOES Wiseman have anyway?

Darkness Between The Stars
Damning Hex
Warp Edge
Awaken, Shade Dragon!
Dagger of the Mind
Eldritch Shift
Gravity Well
And some unnamed power that Dominates

So at least 8 powers, all generic status ailments AND a second form.

>>1446
Dagger of the Mind was the dominate. He has 4 standards, 1 move, 1 minor, 3 triggers, and 2 traits.

Fortunately the next form is simpler in comparison. I think.

>>1448
And here I was worried Betorish had 6 powers.

Hide still has one of the zone-dispelling bolts, right?

>>1452
He should, yes.

Did Astaroth forget Rage of the Crimson Hurricane's Ongoing damage?

>>1454
Apparently I did. Fixed now.

Wiseman should lose 10 more HP then.

Yagi attacking other players is in character

also, where's the spoiler text or w/e to show me what kadol did

>>1458
You can see what she did in her post. She outlined everything very clearly.

Does Fays get an OA.

I just remembered something...

>Howling Strike
>When raging, you can move 2 extra squares as part of this charge
>Doesn't increase your speed by 2, lets you move 2 extra squares

This means that Rock can charge after all. Just move to E-7, and CHARGE! Okay, with charge bonuses in play we can probably do a little bit better. 'Course, we could also just have Lia try to land a clever shot to slide Wiseman into a better position.

>>1463
roolaboos

>>1464
Does that mean something?

>>1464
>>1465
Rule abuse?

I irrationally refuse to partake in this twisting of RAI.

>>1467
Here we go again.

>>1467
You're kidding, right? The rules compendium specifically points out this distinction.

>>1468
>>1469
>I irrationally refuse
>irrationally
Geez, I wasn't even being serious. If I can smash Wiseman face I am happy enough.

>>1470
To be fair, I did say, "you're kidding, right?"

Huh. I hate to screw things up for you astaroth, but I just noticed (if it indeed adds the normal +2 to defenses from second wind) you forgot to add my invigorating stride second wind bonuses this whole time.

>>1472
So I did. Unfortunately, it doesn't change anything.

>>1471
How wise you are.

>>1473
>telling you the dice are rigged
DM admits and confirms he's cheating. Omg

Okay, I'm immobilized so I can't move so no move action this turn. What I'll probably end up doing is blowing my stalker's mist daily (for CA from concealment and better defenses for myself and anyone who possibly wishes to enter). I get +1 to attack and damage against wiseman for the moment cause of my stance, and another +2 damage because he is prone (and I can ignore prone penalties).

Clever shot is possibly needed like Rin said for Rock to get a better attack or get wiseman into a better position, but dazing him seems to be smarter (if I hit) with the attacks he's dishing out.
And if I hit, blowing my Targeting crossbow item daily vs him might seem like a good idea (roll twice on attack rolls vs that enemy, choose which roll you want). For my other minor action, I can just use my diamond belt thing.
That's all i got in my head at the moment, give opinions etc

Don't need Clever Shot, I can charge Wiseman just fine.

>>1475
Since we don't need the slide after all, I think dazing is better. At the very least, it will stop from teleporting away and THEN getting 2 attacks (he still has an action point to spend) provided he lives. I'd like to save the daze for the shade dragon but I don't think we have that luxury. I think we may need to plan for the worst, that is, Wiseman getting another turn. Superior targeting crossbow sounds good. Furthermore, if you daze him, he won't be able to dominate again even if he recharges since it's a burst 1 (provided Fays moves away, which he should).

Speaking of which, Rock may wish to use boots of adept charging to shift AWAY from Wiseman after the charge so he can't dominate you.

If you hit Wiseman with the anti-zone bolt you'll be safe from the damage at least.

hm, I just realized i'm prone too. That makes the chances of me hitting significantly less.

>>1478
Why not just stand first? Being restrained doesn't prevent you from standing.

>>1479
Ah, I thought since restrained meaning you can't move, that you can't stand up. Either way, that means I have to sacrifice me healing myself with the belt or using the mist this turn.

Oh, and slight change in plans: Rock, can you charge the Gargoyle before you charge Wiseman? Swift charge activates on minions still, and we really need to kill that thing before it gets to use its +25 to damage rolls.

So should i just give up my heal this turn and hope for hits etc

>>1482
Your discretion, really. The only attack he can reasonable affect you with at this point is a ranged attack, so the mist has a decent shot at protecting you. Not much we can do about a miss, so yes, just hope it hits. Definitely stand from prone, a -2 is more manageable than a -4.

I'd be amazed if that misses; it'd hit my level 13 Solo. D:

>>1486
A 32 is not gonna miss.

Anyways, strongly recommending:
>>1481

lol

>>1491
Don't you have your "reroll when raging" power? Combat Surge. You should probably use it.

Oh, I forgot to use my daily power from crossbow on Wiseman cause I was so sure i'd miss

I'd like to include that if possible.

>>1493
k go for it

>>1492
But we have another encounter after this.

>>1495
We're not going to have another encounter after this if we die. If we let that gargoyle live our odds of losing go way up.

>>1496
She's got a point. You're charging right next to it, and if it hits you then you're gonna dip into the negatives. You'll not just be a sitting duck, you'll be a sitting duck and a very tempting target. And that's not getting into what happens if the dragon saves against banishment on its turn. Without a dedicated striker the party is pretty much as good as dead.

Trust me, you want that attack to hit.

I mean, makk can potentially save by killing with her interrupt, but she is prone.

This seems to be a "critical moment" to me and a good use of the reroll.

>>1496
Well in the first place that Gargoyle shouldn't have its ridiculous damage bonus. It's only because Astaroth thought a minion doing 2HKO damage that it's such an important target to kill.

Fine, whatever, I'll just leave myself with just the Rage Strike/Rage of the Thunder Hooves for the final encounter.

Reroll managed to hit.
miracle etc.

>>1499
I know, but things are what they are.

Look on the bright side, you landed a hit and can now use Swift Charge to charge Wiseman. Since he's prone you have CA, and you get to roll the attack twice because of Hide's targeting crossbow.

Waiting on follow-up post before update.

>1
aren't you glad for choose what roll you like powers

The dragon just succeeded its saving throw to escape. Will Kadol use her power to force it to reroll?

According to my calcs, Wiseman has 348 damage. We need 52 to finish him off. Can we do it?

Walala should stand and use her 3[W] daily on Wiseman, then give Yagi 20 temporary hit points. Yes, it's at a penalty, but she gets to roll twice. Likewise, Fays should shift away and use BLUNDER on Wiseman, sliding him and granting Rock an attack. That could be enough to kill him. I hope.

I guess we're gambling on Wiseman not recharging his dominate. Granted, if he doesn't, he's in pretty rough shape. Yagi can use Glowering Threat to give the dragon a -5 to all attacks not against Yagi, which is a very good idea, I think, in light of its breath attack.

Who controls the eye? would its +5 damage to Walala, Fays and Rock manage to shift the chances of killing Wiseman? That's 15. Rock can do about 25 effortlessly if he hits (+16 bonus or something, +5 from Rage, +4 minimum from weapon), we're looking at 40 damage, and Fays/Walala just need to pile on 18 damage between the two of us: and Fays does 5 damage with Staggering Note so, walala needs to do 13 damage to win, less if Rock hits harder than expected, more if Rock hits less hard.

>>1511
Unfortunately, Wiseman resists psychic, and the eye deals psychic damage.

It will help against the dragon but not Wiseman.

BTW, I'm going to make the case that Fays should use Blunder to slide Wiseman away from Rock (while still granting the attack). Here is why:

1. While having Wiseman next to Rock will make him take an OA if he uses his ranged power, he's not going to do that. He'll either use his close burst dominate (if it recharges) or his melee attack. Or he'll teleport away and then use his AP for the ranged attack.
2. On the other hand, if he's not in range of Rock... what's he going to do? He can't dominate or use the melee attack. He CAN use the ranged attack, but it's a recharge power, so even if he action points he can't use it twice. Best he can do is curse and then AP+attack, which isn't so dangerous, really. Not with Fays providing Chord of Resilience and Makk still having her Interrupt as well. He could also AP + teleport and use his dominate if it recharges, but he can do that anyway.
3. If he teleports, it'd be better to have no one near him to avoid taking unecessary damage. He does some auto-damage when he teleports.

Basically, I think Wiseman having no creatures adjacent to him when he begins his turn gives him worse options.

So I thought I'd do Makk's turn since it seems like she's busy and won't be able to make it tonight. Aaaaaand I thought I'd try my own dice roller for the hell of it since it seems to be luckier than the one at Invisible Castle...

Well, it crit.
And the crit dice combined for 9 damage.
That's 46 damage.
Putting Wiseman at -395 health.

>>1516
No comment.

Disregard anything I said about Wiseman getting another turn because I no longer think he will.

Cake can save Blunder for the dragon, Staggering Note will be plenty. Remember +1 to attacks vs. Bloodied creatures because of Bloodhunt and roll twice from targeting crossbow.

>>1517
Still push it away from Rock?

>>1521
If you hit, he dies. He has 5 HP left. Don't even need to worry about pushing.

>>1522
Pressure is on.

Does a 23 hit his will? I want to make RP.

>>1523
Well, you have +1 from bloodhunt, +2 from combat advantage, and -2 from him being prone. You get to roll twice, so the odds should be pretty good. You can even use Jinx Shot if you prefer, I don't think his AC is much higher than his Will. Use whatever gets you the biggest attack bonus.

Just make sure to shift away, because using a ranged attack next to him will provoke OAs.

He's dazed, though.

>>1526
Oh, right. Dazed = no opportunity attacks. So you're free to waltz around him if you like.

>>1525
I already rolled http://invisiblecastle.com/roller/view/3275650/ and I think the numbers are right, if they aren't it's because it's 5 AM. I just wanted to throw some fancy words in for it.

>>1528
They look right to me. And I am pretty sure a 23 is a hit, should be able the maximum possible NAD for a level 10 monster if I remember my stats well enough off-hand.

23 is a hit, yes.

Is Yagi still dominated when he dies?

Can't take my turn for a few hours, but I'll get on that as soon as I am able. In the meantime... before my lunch break ends...

Yagi should no longer be dominated by the way

wtf, how did you think that was balanced.

Wow, he only needs to hit once to one-shot half the party.

Why did you guys not want me to use my sacrificial gouge straight away again? D:

Also off-hand I think that puts Yagi over his bloodied value in negative hitpoints and kills him outright. Holy crud, we need to get our HP to full stat before he straight-out murders us all.

Aaaaah who was saying the Shade Dragon wasn't that big a worry, he's a huge worry.

Astaroth, are you SURE this guy complies to MM3 standards? Because the Adult Earthquake Dragon, at level 14, does 3d8+9 damage with its Claw attack, and the Adult Volcanic Dragon at level 15 does 2d10+5 and ongoing fire damage.

None of those monsters can do 60 damage with one attack! In fact, the level 24 Ancient Earthquake Dragon from MM3 does 4d8+14 damage! That barely hits 60!

Yes, I panic.

Bear in mind that he's using a double attack with an action point. There won't be another nova round for the rest of the fight.

>>1553
The point is that he only landed one attack according to spoiler text. He can do that without Action Point so for all we know he always does this damage.

Ah, he used a claw double attack twice, rather than just a single claw attack twice.

Geez stop scaring like that.

Ririane: The Shade Dragon only hit with one claw.
Ririane: According to Astaroth's spoiler text.
Tohsaka: No, apparently that wording is still confusing? It was 4 seperate attacks
Ririane: Oh, then that makees it more understandable.
Ririane: Because he says "uses Claw twice".
Ririane: "missing once"
Tohsaka: It's somewhat misleading since claw is in and of itself a double attack
Astarotho: Level 10
Ririane: Geez then he needs to be more clear about it.
Astarotho: sorry
Ririane: If you say something attacks twice and misses once.
Ririane: Of course people'll think it hit once and did 60 damage with that one attack.
Ririane: :|

>>1555
originally though it seemed like it was one attack before he changed it, hence my response earlier til it was fixed

So anyway, if Walala uses Shocking Feedback on the first hit, it will reduce the damage Yagi takes by a lot. Fays can use Chord of Resilience to reduce it further.

I really, really suggest these things happen.

Okay, here's how your little break is going to go down:
-you recover all your encounter attack powers and encounter utility powers
-Fays regains all uses of Majestic Word
-Walala can craft up to two healing infusions, but only if somebody spends a healing surge without gaining any other benefit
-You can spend up to two healing surges to heal yourself. No more than that, be it second wind or healing powers.
-Any powers spent during the rest will not recharge during the next encounter.
-You may not ready actions.
I may add/remove whatever rules at my own discretion.

Is that 'all your encounter attack powers and all your encounter utility powers' or 'all your encounter attack powers and all your utility powers'?

>>1579
Encounter utilities, thanks for pointing that out.

If I'm permitted I'll happily donate a healing surge for infusion purposes, but I'm not sure if the two surge limit included that.

>>1583
You can only spend two surges to heal yourself. The healing infusion crafting doesn't have anything to do with that limit.

I should have something like 6 surges left so I can throw a couple of those to Walala.

Let's see... I should have 7 left. I'll donate 2 and have 5 left. I don't think there's any possible way I can spend 5 in the next fight.

>>1589
For all we know, Aberrant Wiseman drains surges like wights.

>>1591
It'd be unfair of me to comment on that, so I'll be operating under the assumption that he does not.

Well, it's not a mantis shrimp, but it's close enough, right?

The turn order looks good to me, but we need to figure out how to keep Yagi up a round. Might be time for that second wind.

>>1600
He rolled max on his initiative. I was kind of surprised.

>>1601
On of the reasons I'm not completely sold on the "instinctive action" setup of monster design is because it often just leads to the monster taking two turns in a row, which isn't exactly the way I think it should work. Ah well.

>>1602
I meant you, not Wiseman. Though I think he came pretty close.

>>1603
Sorry, forgot my name. Think you're confusing me with someone else.

>>1604
If you didn't like it, you should have said something about it before when you examined it.

>>1605
No, no, I'm not blaming you. I didn't even think of it at the time so I can't complain about this particular encounter, and anyway it won't be getting two turns QUITE in a row either.

It's the sort of thing that I'd probably DM-fiat to set the monster init somewhere in the middle of the pack, possibly by making its result the instinctive action and having it move at -10. I'm not saying you should do that, though, since that's a personal preference and more has to do with what I consider to be a good flow to combat and offering more interesting situations and choices rather than dealing with balance.

>>1606
My solo won't even have instinctive action.

>>1607
The idea behind instinctive actions--that if a solo has 5 enemies' worth of EXP, it should be able to take more actions than non-solos--is a good one that I agree with. The only problem I have with it is when the monster rolls high on init and gets two back-to-back "turns."

Well it's more that I don't understand it quite as much, and my solo's accompanied by an elite of a lower level than the solo itself. Not sure if adding an instinctive action won't be overdoing it, but I wouldn't mind adding it... :D

>>1609
The problem with relying on things like Immediate Actions and Opportunity Actions to give them more actions is Dazing (or Stunning!) the enemy takes all of those away, and a five-to-six person party shouldn't have any problem keeping a monster dazed for 2-3 rounds past the mid levels (most can do it even at the lowest levels).

When I did the Bloodspire Outrider + Spirehorn Behemoth encounter, I basically made it so that the mount (the behemoth) got a free attack whenever the rider attacked. That was my attempt at giving it more actions. It didn't work as well as I hoped, because there wasn't enough of an incentive to attack the rider over the mount... but that was the rationale behind the setup. Anyways, there's no one "right" way to do it, and the Instinctive Action thing isn't all that bad. I'd just probably DM fiat it a bit if I was running it myself.

instictive action on -10 it's probably a good idea, just to be sure add the solo a +10 to init as well

>>1610
It'll be fine in parlor 2, I have plenty of time to adjust.

I just finished the definitive forms of the seven sisters, so it'd be megas if I could show you them sometime for feedback.

Yagi, if you're taking Sohei you have to give up whatever item your last theme granted you.

Also, Loss of Will is supposed to drop prone when the target is moved 2 or more squares, not more than 2. That was a typo and not my original intent.

And then you realise that even if you had it "two squares or more", Wiseman still can't prone with his double-attack, because it counts as making two seperate attacks.

Even outside that, Wiseman's not too terrible to deal with. The worst he can do is Minor Action "lol hit someone with an at-will or suffer". Oh, and fly, which isn't that threatening because Lia can At-Will Prone. (otherwise I'd be >:| at you for making a Solo that basically flips the bird to melee)

Speaking of, can you really "shift" into the sky? How does that even work?


You need to expand your scope to making encounters a bit like puzzles as well. Most our encounters have been straight-forward "beat up the boss", with no real synergy between monsters. They don't really support eachother, it's just a bunch of heavy hitters calling in other heavy hitters.

Speaking of, where did Wiseman slide Rock to with the first hit? If Rock was still adjacent Wiseman at that time, I am using Curtain of Steel.