Sorcerer/Witch side rules:
1.The victory conditions are:
A. Wins if any of the riddles goes unslolved at the end of the game.
B. Wins if the human side makes an unsuccesful logic error acusation (Details below).
2.It's closed rooms must be solvable following the rules stated here.
3.If the Sorcerer/Witch side wins, it must explain all the tricks to the human side.
4.The witch is able to use the corpses in the island to create new closed rooms. I.E. Disappearing corpses. Using Grandfather's corpse...

Human side rules:
1. Wins if:
A. Solves all the riddles at the end of the game. Which translates into a vicotry for all the Human players.
B. Making a succesful logic error acusation (again, details below) or if the Sorcerer/Witch is unable to explain the trick after the endgame. It's a victory for all Human players.
2.There's no detective proclamation (ability to be omniscient about the clues). However, the information given by the Humans' examinations are always as they are presented, no need to doubt your piece's senses.
3.All discussion between detectives must belong to the "OOC thread", which will act too as a "Detective's lounge".
4.The Human isn't forced to solve the riddles that the Sorcerer doesn't present, which means, if candy appears "magically" inside a cup, but the Sorcerer doesn't ask how it was done, then that riddle's solution won't be necessary to win the game as Human.
5.The detectives don't know about about secret instalations or places of the island.
6.The detectives don't have forensic examination tools nor they have forensic knowledge beyond the level of a normal person.
7.The detectives cannot teleport, read minds or do any supernatual move.
8.The detectives' pieces cannot use proof from outside the gameboard.

Weapons/tools.

Sorcerer/Witch side:
-Gameboard creation: The Sorcerer can create the elements of the gameboard as long as they follow the rules and don't change the general layout.
-Red truth: The red truth are undeniable facts that need no proof. Example of use: No life forms aside from humans are related to the game
-Riddle proposing: Sorcerer's main weapon, the ability of create riddles and closed rooms for the Human side to solve.
-Refusing to answer right now to the petitions of the Human side.
-Declare metaworld: The option to start a metaworld.
-Absolute control of the family (NPC): The Sorcerer can control the actions/objects/clues of the family. The family members are the same as Umineko.
-Unreliability of narration: If the Sorcerer desires so, he can disguise the murders with magic or fake tales. However that does not affect that all the red, human's examinations results and some purple must be always true.
-Purple declaration: The Sorcerer can make the NPCs speak in purple, stating facts following it's rules (the rules can be found in http://umineko.wikia.com/wiki/Purple_Declaration), the only rule omitted is "Outside of spoken statements, there are no lies in the narration" because the ureliability of narration rule.

Human side:
-Blue truth: Theories that deny the ilusion of the Witch/Sorcerer. Example of use: You did not kill them with magic, There were nano explosives in the food they ate! That is why their faces and guts are destroyed.
-Ask the witch to repeat something in Red: Asking for the confirmation of a fact. Example: Repeat it in Red: "No one left the room after they first entered".
-Refusing to answer right now the riddles of the Sorcerer side.
-Piece actions: Every piece has the right to make a total of three actions within the Humans' side turn. The actions allowed are listed below. Not all the actions cost the same. If anyone makes an impossible action it will be discounted as every action build up upon that action. Example: 1.Examine lamp 2.Go to New York 3.Examine Empire State Building.
In this example only the first would happen, for it's impossible right now to go to New York, and thus, impossible to examine the ESB. In other words, the piece would have wasted two actions.
-Duct tape: Two pieces of duct tape per detective, enough to seal one door/window/entrance. It's the only way to perfectly seal a door, the only way of remove it is breaking it. It is possible to trade it with.
-Logic error accusation: Human side's last, ultimate trump card. If the Human side thinks that a closed room is unsolvable, or that there's a contradiction in the Red/Proofs, they can use that accusation to force the Sorcerer/Witch to explain the trick. This is a high stakes gamble: If the Sorcerer is unable to explain it then is a victory for the Human side, however, if the Sorcerer is able to explain it without contradicting the Red nor proofs, it's a victory for the Sorcerer/Witch side. However due the danger of that double-sided sword, it can only be used when >50% of the Human side agrees to make it.

Moves allowed to the Human side and it's costs:
-Finish investigating (0 actions): End own's turn. It automatically triggers when made 3 actions.
-Look around (0 actions): It would give a short description of the elements around the piece. The people, the corpses, the furniture, the entrances and exits, the objects...
-Give ____ to ____ (0 actions): Give a object to someone, must be in the same room.
-Go to ____ (1 action): Go to a place, if there is a single murder with various closed rooms (I.e. BotGW, 1st. Twilight) moving between them has no cost. Also, each time there's a murder, the Sorcerer will ask to the detectives if they want to go to the place where's the corpse without any cost.
-Examine ____ (1 action): Examine something. The more general the thing, the less detailed.
-Ask ____ about ____ (1 action): Ask any NPC something. The more general the thing, the less detailed.
-Use duct tape (1 action): Use the duct tape pieces that you have to seal doors and windows.
-Make an accusation (2 actions): If anyone thinks that they have found the culprit. They will make their accusation and show their proofs. If they manage to overcome the Innocence presumption with proofs then the culprit will be shut away. However if they can't show definitive proof the accusation will fail and nothing will happen. If the culprit cannot be locked then the accusation won't have effect untill the culprit can be succesfully locked.
If the theory doesn't go against the facts stated in the Rules or the Metaworld then it's a victory of the Human side.
If the theory goes against that facts the game will continue with the "culprit" locked.

Any ilegal action will follow the rules stated in the "Piece actions" from "Humans' side Weapons/Tools"


Well, what do you think about it?

Pretty good. You thought a lot on it and is very organized. Rules are simple and this can be a fun game.

Good job! But I don'tknow if I will join this game, since my time zone is +6 from /seacats/ clock and Feb. 7th I'll return to College.

However, if those problems won't interfere, I'll let you know.

Interesting. Ignoring my curiosity towards when exactly this would be played, I'll ask this:

You intend on being the witch/sorcerer side correct?

>>5872
That's a good point, Ozaki!

If you are going to be Witch Side, do you accept helpers or you is going to be yourself against the others 4-8 people?

>>5872
Well, I did create a scenario for this game. The reason behind this is simple: I just cannot propose a game like this if the game doesn't have anything to get played with.
Of course I'm planning to play as the sorcerer.
However, if anyone is willing to make their own tale with this game, I would be more than glad to let them assume the role of witch/sorcerer and play as human myself.
In other words:
No one has a tale/wants to do it -> I'll gladly be the sorcerer with my own tale.
Someone has a tale and wants to play with it -> I'll let him/her be the sorcerer/witch and play his/her tale as human.

The reason I've thought so carefully about the rules is that anybody can play with them no matter what role they have.

>>5873
About the number of players I only did it because as they say "The more the merrier", and since it includes the sorcerer/witch it would be against 3-7.
About the helpers, well, I did not planned to have any because it could be difficult to help the sorcerer.
If you know any way, please let me know.

And when we will begin this? Well I guess I'll wait two days after we get enough people to start.

So long as it's not like erikos "gameboard". That was just people rping with free reign and red/blue whatever they want and ruining the characterization.

>>5874
Personally I think it would be best if you used your scenario. You know the rules better then anyone after all.

I'll sign up for the Detective side.

>>5876
I sign for the Witch-side

>>5877
Calm down Lion, why don't we allow this person to use his own game?

I'll join the detective's side.

>>5877
I agree with anon, I want to see this person's game.

>>5878
as a helper obviously not as the GM

>>5876
Well then, we are now two in this.
You have a point with me being the sorcerer, so I'm going to follow your suggestion and use my scenario in this game.

>>5877
I'm glad you want to join, however the sorcerer/witch side only has one player that is the one that creates all the riddles in the game. In this scenario at least I plan to assume that role. I apologize for the inconvenience as well as I remind you of the human side which has still free spots.
Of course there's also the option of creating your own game if you aren't satisfied with my options.
Do as you wish.

>>5882
I'm glad you said that, U-kun (can I call you this way?), because I was going to sign to Witch's side too.

But, as I said, I can't corroborate my presence in your game right now. I'll let this on hold by now, ok?

Oh! A question: If the game already starts when I want to come in, can I join like, for example, an outsider from Rokkenjima? (Like Erika, for example)

>>5882
ah ok, then I will watch your game as an observer

>>5880
That makes us three then.

>>5881
As I said before: "About the helpers, well, I did not planned to have any because it could be difficult to help the sorcerer."
I hope you can understand.

>>5885
Its okay don't worry hehehe~

I think I could precise the mechanics of "Pieces actions"
You get three each human turn, if you don't use them you lose them, you can make only the actions listed in the rules. You cannot make ilegal/impossible actions, those actions will be discounted as any actions build up in them. More details in the rules, sections "Human's weapons/tools" and "Moves allowed".

>>5883
I don't know, if you want to join later you would have less turns and thus less actions to make, also I don't know what will think the detectives that are already in the game.

What do you think everyone, shall I let Eriko join later in the game or not?

P.S.You can call me however you want, it doesn't bother me.

>>5887
An inquiry: Will we be able to get items besides the duct tape? An example being like using evidence from the crime scene to interrogate people. Of course this could cause complications so I can understand if you decide against it.

Oh, and regarding players showing up halfway through the game. I don't really mind, but I would suggest having their piece in game from the start, and have it follow the NPC's until the player actually shows up. Otherwise if you were to use a gimmick like where they wash up on the island half way through the game, then they would be pretty much forced to use meta knowledge or something of the sort.

>>5888
Good argument. I agree with Ozaki.

>>5888
Well then, Eriko will be in the gameboard as NPC untill the player shows up.

About using other items as evidence, you can ask questions about them as if the item was there. The NPCs will have a good memory and will remember about the item as it was. However you cannot take the item with yourself because it could create irregularities, for example if someone takes all the doors and means to kill in the island then the sorcerer would not have any way to continue an thus the game would be destroyed.

Well, since two days have passed since we got 4 players I will proceed to start with this game. Should I start it here or in other thread?

>>5927
If you post it in another thread, this one could be used as the "OOC thread"

>>5928
I'm from GMT +1

Any chance of me joining in this too?

I had experience attempting to make RP Gameboards back in the day, but I've lacked any good inspiration regarding gameboards since before the original site's crash.

>>5938
I don't know. It's true that the game started but is also true that the typhoon hasn't arrived yet. I don't want to say that since you are late you can't enter so I propose you a thing:
-You will start playing in the second round. I will take care that you can make a decent and coherent entrance in the game between rounds one and two. I also ask you to modify your name to avoid confusions between you and the piece "Rudolf".
If you agree with that then you are in, however, no one will enter the island once the typhoon arrives, which translates into "No one will be able to enter the island if they don't say they want to join before round one is completed."
Also don't worry about not being the best detective. I think that, if the player likes to think, everyone can enjoy this game.

>>5940
Very well, thank you for allowing me to play.

In article #6 of "Human Side's Rules", you say that: "The detectives don't have forensic examination tools nor they have forensic knowledge beyond the level of a normal person".

However, I have some Anatomical Knowledge due to my college course. Here is my question: Can my piece have the same anatomical knowledge I have?

>>5954
It depends, what are we talking about?

>>5957
Bones and muscles.

I have some knowledge about organs, but my professor that taught this was very lame one. So, we can discard a more deep knowledge about organs.


I have some First Aid Knowledge too, but I think that all Pieces know this already.

>>5959
Granted, your piece has also that knowledge.
When I say "forensic knowledge beyond the level of a normal person" I mean I didn't want a piece like Erika as she was in EP5, it would break the game.

Mansion's sorroundings

Guesthouse 1st floor

As I can see, there is no Courtyard, right?

>>5976
I just forgot about the courtyard.
But wasn't the courtyard just a part of the exterior of the mansion?
Anyway, if you point out where is it and how is it I'll correct myself.

>>5978
Courtyard is the internal part from Main Building. Like this: Main Building is a gigant square with a "hole" in the middle.

>>5979
I've based my layout in the information given by two of the main sources of Umineko. So maybe some details are more inspired in one source than the other.
But anyway, since it would be such a big change I will stay with my maps, I hope you can understand that these maps are not perfect and I tried to overcome the imprecise information about the layout how I could.
But anyway, the courtyard won't have an important part in my game and everything that could be done in the courtyard can also be done outside the mansion.

>>5980
Actually, you know what. I'll change the layout to be precise.

For the record I always thought Kinjo's courtyard was stupid. Also fun fact, the mansion right in front of the garden is actually the guesthouse, me and Kinjo confirmed this a week ago.

Anyway don't worry about it, I like the latest maps you posted, we should use them.

>>5985
>Also fun fact, the mansion right in front of the garden is actually the guesthouse, me and Kinjo confirmed this a week ago.

You didn't know about it all this time? lol

>>5985
By the way, yours is "Guest Room 3"

When, for example, we start to investigate 1st Twillight Corpses, we will spend 1 action per corpse or 1 action for all 6 corpses?

>>5991
You can do both actions:
"Examine corpses." and "Examine X's corpse." are valid actions that only cost as one action each. However, if you do the latter it will give you a more specific view of that thing.
As stated in the rules: "The more general the thing, the less detailed".

>>5988
you'll be surprised on how it was only mentioned once or twice, with everything that is umineko it makes sense for information to get mixed up.

I would like to remind that Kinjo still has one move left because "take the rope" it's not a valid option.

And with this the first round ends. Be ready for round two.
Anyway, is there any question before we continue the game? Any problems with the mechanics?

>>5999
I don't have any. Pretty simple mechanic and we have to think a lot for spend 3 moves with wisdom. In my opinion, we can proceed.

>>5999
everything seems fine to me.

No questions here.

I just want to say the reason we're having the metaworld before the examinations is quite simple: To give the players information so they are more oriented on how to use their moves because using blue and red is more convenient than moving your piece.
You see, in later metaworlds you can also get back at previous unsolved questions with your newer evidence. So you don't need to stress yourself out trying to solve everything right now, you can leave them for later. Of course everything can be solved right away, but you can also get some hints from your investigations.

I was thinking for a while: How are we going to "interview" the suspects? Or will we try to get everyone together in the same place for two days?

What is the strategy? I was thinking, about "interviewing", do the same thing as Willard: Put each suspect in an different room and ask some questions to them.

And, about corpse investigation: Can I do this? Since my piece has some knowledge about anatomy etc.

>>6075
Not a bad idea to do separately. It'll take longer, but "time" is all in a manner of posts, and we could even split up and interview different npc's

>>6075
About interviews: I've thought on moving everyone to the crime scene so you can ask whoever you want. You can also ask different people.
The idea of diferent rooms isn't bad, however since "go to X" except if there is a single murder with various closed rooms may hinder the process.
I remind you that the action is "Ask _____ to ______"
About corpses: Of course you can examine them. However forensic investigation is not allowed.
>>6077
You can certainly ask different things to different NPCs.

I would like to remind that the detectives must choose where they want to start before we can start the examination process

Sorry, I've just been so busy recently. I may perhaps need to sit out for the rest of this game.

>>6242
I'll look over the bodies for external wounds, flipping the bodies if I have to.

>>6242
Don't worry, there's the NPC option. You see, when by any reason someone can't play right now, their pieces will remain in the gameboard as NPCs. The players have full right to reenter the game later on. Think what happened when Ange in EP8 didn't want to play, the same works here. Of course your piece will be treated with respect and "will close itself in its room" untill the player decides to join us later.

If you want to leave for now or retake action, please state it clearly in this thread.

All other actions regarding the game, please state them in the other thread.

>>6268
whoops wrong thread

Okay, if Rudolfo sits out of this round that would leave Kinjo to decide the location of it's piece.

Or shall I just move from now on everyone's pieces to the crime scene and start right away with the actions?

>>6303
I'll just follow the other detectives. If they split up, I guess I'll follow Kinjo.

>>6379
Okay then. Rudolfo will be now following Kinjo